Information By: TOYOTA RACING – CHARLOTTE, NC – Joe Gibbs Racing driver Denny Hamlin was made available to the media on Wednesday as part of the NASCAR Cup Series Playoff Media Day.
DENNY HAMLIN, No. 11 FedEx Toyota Camry XSE, Joe Gibbs Racing
What do you put your odds at for making it to the Championship 4 and what trouble spots do you see with the rounds this year?
“I feel like our chances are as good as anyone. Now, I would say that the 45 (Tyler Reddick), the 20 (Christopher Bell), the 5 (Kyle Larson) have a better chance because they have more Playoff points going into the Playoffs. But, ultimately, we’re one of the very few cars that can win any given week. So, no matter what points position we might find ourselves in, and we will be in a precarious points position at some point of the Playoffs. We always feel like we can go to the next track and win, so that’s on something that only a few cars can do.”
Do you think the first round could be the toughest with the races that are scheduled?
“Yeah, absolutely. Certainly, with a new road course in there in Watkins Glen in the Playoffs, with an unknown tire. Atlanta – who knows. I haven’t finished a superspeedway Next Gen race I don’t think in my entire career. It’s just who knows what can happen. We might have to go to Bristol and win but if that’s the case, we will.”
Does it feel like this is going to be a tough Playoffs to make it through?
“Absolutely. Because of the variables. Like, it’s one thing to not have many Playoff points but then to not have them on tracks that you know that your result is not necessarily in always your hands, it certainly makes it a precarious position but it’s what we got and I’ll do the best that I can and I know that I’m going to go to the track with the same mindset and that’s to win every week.”
Did the penalty invigorate your team and give your team motivation?
“I think it will if it has a positive outcome. I really can’t honestly say to you that it was something that we rallied around. I mean, certainly, it took away 15 points when you add it all up in the regular season as well. Fifteen points every round that we lost. That’s something that’s really going to be hard to overcome, but we can. I know that we can. So, that’s the good news. If we are able to find ourselves making it through these first two, three rounds and have a shot at it – at Phoenix I should say, then that’s going to be a very rewarding feeling. And, so, if there’s ever a year to win it, do it when there’s the most adversity on the line.”
Should the season finale rotate?
“Yeah, certainly but there’s always going to be challenges contractually. There’s a lot of red tape involved with that. City councils and money going this way and that way so it will be hard.”
Where is the charter conversation right now?
“Stagnant.”
What has to be done from either side to move it to the next level?
“One side will have to wake up and be reasonable. That’s all.”
Which side?
“Not ours.”
What made Curtis wear the sign on his shirt at Darlington?
“Frustration.”
Do you think his message was received?
“I’m not sure. You know, certainly, pretty disappointed to not see anyone from NASCAR present Tyler (Reddick) his trophy. That was a little disappointing.”
Do you think that was personal?
“I don’t know. That was the first I’ve seen.”
Do you feel like we’re getting the story that it’s getting closer?
“Of course, they want it to, but the truth is they keep going in the wrong direction.”
Are you telling the truth?
“I believe I am from our standpoint, but it depends on who you ask. But certainly, I feel like yeah, there’s probably a handful of teams that are just happy to take any deal that they can get and there’s others with some business sense that says this is unreasonable.”
Can you talk to the teams?
“Yeah, of course, but everyone’s going to do what their own – what they want to do that’s best for their team and each one of the teams will execute an agreement that they feel is fair for themselves.”
Do you have others in your ear asking you to say things on their behalf?
“I think, not directly, no, but they don’t hate it either. I don’t love being the megaphone. I wish some of these other owners who are griping to me through text and calls would just do it publicly themselves, but I think that they fear pushback.”
What’s the fear of pushback if you’re trying to improve?
“Yeah, that’s the thing. We’re all trying to improve the sport and grow the sport. We all want what’s best for the sport. If the sport does great, we will do better, so I think we all just need to figure out how to lock arms and do it together. But we don’t have any agreement in front of us that is locking of arms, it’s all one sided.”
Are the younger owners more vocal because the veteran owner’s future is more intact?
“I guess. People see me gripe, but they have to realize I made a good living in this as a NASCAR driver and I chose to invest back in the France family and NASCAR, and they are yet to show me an opportunity where I’m going to get that back.”
What do you have to do to win at Watkins Glen?
“I’m not sure. I think there’s going to be such an unknown with the tire there that I’m somewhat excited for. I think that if you think about, will I be one of the top five fastest guys? Maybe unlikely, but if you put a tire situation in there, maybe. So, certainly, that there’s an opportunity there that we could capitalize on. I think it just depends on where I net out after Atlanta. I think you’d be dumb and bull-headed to just say this is our strategy for the first round and that’s what we’re going to do. I think it has to be fluid based off of your position.”
Chase Elliott said the first round is little gimmicky, do you agree?
“He said it, I agree.”
But you won Bristol?
“But we won it in the non-gimmicky way. This race last year we won it in the Playoffs as well and it didn’t have any of those variables you talked about. So, we can win in multiple different ways and fashions. What I love about our team is everything that you just said. I feel like I’ve got one of the best crew chiefs and the best teams in the garage, and there’s only two to three of us that knows that they can win every single week that they hit the track and we’re one of them.”
Will the speculation on the tire degradation at Watkins Glen put a price on flipping the stage and restarting on older tires?
“It certainly will. I certainly think that it could definitely play a role in strategy. It’s been so straight forward in the past that you just want to get to those stage points and then you go ahead and pit. But certainly, if tires are going to matter like it seems like they might, it throws a whole new element in it and it’s not a huge gimmicky element because you have to strategize around tire wear. The driver plays a huge role in that, so certainly, hopefully I’ve got my fingers crossed that it’s a race that’s going to be unlike any road course we’ve seen.”
Do you fear a Playoff race-winner spoiler at a Watkins Glen or Atlanta?
“Well, certainly, I think with some of the cars that didn’t make the Playoffs, there’s a chance of that – the Chris Buescher’s of the world and Ross Chastain’s – they can win at races like that. Certainly, I think given our type – Atlanta this weekend, we could have someone outside the top 30 again win. It’s a realistic thing that could happen, but it’s part of the format that’s the variables that you can’t account for. It’s impossible to predict.”
Should NASCAR do any changes to their points system to avoid something like that happening?
“Yeah, I don’t know how it’s good. I think that you can have those moments without necessarily taking a car that was towards the back and they’re playing by the rules, right? I have nothing against Harrison (Burton). But then taking out someone that has scored twice as much or three times as many points as them throughout the year. I’m always going to be in favor of a bigger sample size, instead of one race and you’re in.”
Can a charter deal get done with NASCAR with 10 races to go and what happens if it’s not done by Phoenix?
“Yeah, absolutely, it could. But, again, someone will have to wake up and have a completely different mindset and I just don’t know if that is going to be possible. What happens if the season ends? Then, we retain all of our rights.”
Is it clear that you retain all of your rights?
“Yeah, if we don’t have a charter agreement, we don’t owe the series anything and they don’t owe us anything, so it goes both ways for sure.”
Can they stop you from racing without charters?
“I don’t think so. Yeah, I don’t think they can stop you from racing. I mean, Joe and Billy’s garage can put a car together and run a race the way our sport is formed right now.”
Curtis’ shirt said I don’t want my charter taken away – is that a threat?
“Yeah, it’s a threat. That’s if you speak negatively. If they don’t like what you say, yeah, they’re trying to reserve the right.”
So, do you have to be measured?
“I don’t know how you – it’s subjective. How do you even – who’s the jury, the judge and the executioner? It sounds like it’s all the same person. It’s never been the same person, but now they’re proposing that it is.”
Who would be the person?
“Them.”
Which is who?
“Whoever is in charge. I don’t know.”
Do you have many bargaining chips left as an owner?
“Yeah, I mean, I’m not really sure where leverage lies. I would argue both sides feel like they have some, but I think it’s more just a frustration of a lack of acknowledgement that the teams have built this sport. (Rick) Hendrick and (Joe) Gibbs putting superstars on the race track – that is what has built the sport. Fans do not come to see cars going around in circles. If they would, then we would sell out ARCA races, but they don’t. They come to sell out on Sunday to watch Chase Elliott and Kyle Larson and Kyle Busch. So, who provides them the cars? And that’s the teams. Who spends the money? That’s the teams. Whose sponsors go buy a suite? That’s the teams. Whose sponsors activate in their midways? That’s the teams. That’s the tough part that, they just don’t value us.”
Did you think this negotiation would go into the Playoffs?
“Oh, yeah, I had a feeling this was going to go all the way to the 11th hour for sure. And there’s just been a lot of stall tactics that have been in play and here we are.”
Is this a distraction?
“Certainly, I’m going to thrive in chaos. That’s my MO. But, generally speaking, I always prepare as much as I can as a driver, do my job as an owner, do my job as a podcaster and certainly, are my days filled now with disgruntled people calling me saying we’ve got to do this or we’ve got to do that, yeah, absolutely. But it doesn’t change when I put my helmet on. I’m always going to be locked in.”
Do you feel like being an owner is a big important part of your legacy?
“I’m just trying to make it better than what it was and still try to grow it and it’s unfortunate. I wish I had a bigger role in it. Certainly, there’s been some changes that have happened around some conversations that you have, and I think NASCAR for a while has been very receptive to listening to advice and some things. But certainly, when it comes to dollars and cents, that’s where we’re in two different ballparks. As a driver, I’ve put in 20 years doing this and I feel like I’ve tried to do my best to grow social following, giving more content. Things like that. Trying to update the times, right? I tried to start a race team to build my legacy well beyond being a race car driver itself. Being part of the sport, investing in Jim France, investing in NASCAR. You know, I’m doing my part, but certainly I think probably from their standpoint they just see me as a thorn in their side and more than likely would be better off without me.”
Have they ever warned you?
“Of course. Yeah, of course.”
If you buy a charter, own it, abide by all the rules and finish where you’re supposed to finish, how can they take a charter from you?
“I don’t know. It doesn’t make sense.”
How can they threaten that?
“I’m not sure. It would have to be explored for sure.”
In what ways do you think Ty Gibbs has grown as a driver?
“I would say generally speaking, I think he’s (Ty Gibbs) has matured some. I see it on the race track. Certainly, he’s more aware of situations. I mean, experience in this series does mean a lot and I think that he knows he’s with a really great team and he’s doing a better job, in my opinion, the last half of the regular season of executing decent days when he has a decent car. That comes from managing risks and I think he’s understanding how to do that.”
Are you still looking at having Martin Truex Jr. run the Daytona 500 next February?
“Yeah, 23XI and JGR (Joe Gibbs Racing) are kind of looking at the options and trying to figure out what’s the best avenue for it but certainly having Martin (Truex Jr.) in the 500 is going to be exciting.”
Is there more in the driver’s hands or less this first round?
“There’s less. Simply because I feel as though having this extra superspeedway in there in Atlanta, it just might put you in a hole that you cannot overcome. Because this is a race that you could easily go finish 32nd or 33rd and have one point and you find yourselves 20-some behind and even being solid at Watkins Glen or good at Bristol, it might not be enough. So, I think that anytime again we shrink the sample size down to three races, and one of those three is one that most drivers would say I don’t have a role in where I finish. I try to do the best I can to avoid the wreck and that’s it. And, now it’s down to a two-race season and that’s hard for us to overcome if we don’t get through the first one.”
Is making it to the Championship 4 still a meaningful stat to you?
“Absolutely. 100 percent. If I can make it to the Championship 4 this year with all the variables that got thrown our way, it would be one of the more rewarding accomplishments I feel like in my career.”
How challenging has this year been for you?
“Yeah, it’s been challenging for sure whether it be the charter stuff or team stuff or driver stuff or penalty stuff. It’s certainly a lot but I feel as energized as I ever have. I don’t know how or why but I still have the stamina to do it and still have the drive to want to do it. It’s been trying, no doubt about it. Trust me, when I walk in that room and they said basically three of your race wins won’t count towards the Playoffs, it was like holy crap. That’s a big, big deal. And it’s certainly something that’s totally out of my control. I wish I could control it, but I can’t. But it’s just part of this sport and I just have to come to grips with, I’m not going to be able to control my outcome. Sometimes it’s going to roll black 10 times in a row and never hit red.”
As you begin the Playoff quest, this is the march for that ring that your fiancé joked you were still looking for?
“That was my comment. I like to troll myself (laughter). I certainly believe that a championship this year would be more rewarding than any of the other years just simply because of all of the variables that we just talked about. So, trust me, I’m going to give it my 100 percent effort to make sure I find myself in a position to win.”
How aware were you of how Tyler Reddick was feeling on Sunday?
“I didn’t know anything until I was in the car, and they told me over the radio, he’s (Tyler Reddick) battling. I was not made aware – 23XI – Dave Rogers tries to shield race day 23XI drama away from me because he’s like, you do enough during the week. I don’t need to bother you with all of this stuff. We have protocols in place with backup drivers and whatnot. They shielded me from that, so I didn’t know until the race.”
Would you have been surprised if Tyler Reddick got out of the car during the race?
“I would’ve been surprised if he did, yes. It’s just, drivers themselves, they just never ever want to get out of their car and see someone else run. And, certainly with what was at stake for him, he would rather lose it on his terms.”
What do you think Martin Truex Jr.’s legacy is going to be?
“This sport can forget about you really quick. I just hope we don’t forget about Martin (Truex Jr.) because I think his career accomplishments are so highly regarded from my standpoint, right? While he might not have as many wins as I have, he hasn’t been with championship caliber teams all of his career like I have. So, I think that he’s just a grossly underrated driver. We had a survey earlier I had to fill out (at media day) who’s the most underrated driver? Martin Truex Jr. is the most underrated. He makes himself underrated because he doesn’t want to talk about himself. He doesn’t want to talk about his accomplishments because he’s a very modest human and he doesn’t want the fanfare. I’ll sing his praises for him that he’s just been the best.”
How do you right the results for the 11 team now that you are in the Playoffs?
“We’ve had speed, but my average finish is atrocious. We will dive into it when the season is over on how much atrociousness did, I cause, versus – there is a column called racing shit happens and that is the things that neither myself or the team causes to have a bad day. It is someone crashed right in front of us at whatever track it might be or blown engine in Sonoma and finishing dead last. There is a column, and I like to keep track of – what did I control, how good did I did do it, and what I need to improve on. It’s really hard to judge our season, because we are fast. One of the two or three best cars every single week. Yet our average finish and points position would tell you otherwise, so there is clearly a disconnect there that we have to hem up.”
Do you think you can during this Playoff run?
“100 percent. I think we went on a pretty good long streak in the spring, early summer and then we went on this really bad run of finishes and now, surely this thing comes back around where the racing gods are a little nicer.”
How do you manage 23XI’s success on race day, especially in later rounds in the Playoffs?
“Yeah, I’m rooting for them. I’m rooting for them to make the final four and lose to me by finishing second. That’s what I really want. I can tell you with honesty and look in your eye, I would be just as happy with an owner’s championship this year as I would with a drivers, because I know how much it took and how much it takes to win a championship in NASCAR, clearly, I know – I’ve been in the sport long enough. I know that I had my hands in every part of that race car – it would be hugely gratifying for myself. If anything, I feel like my chances are doubled this year. While the 45 (Tyler Reddick) made it last year, but they had too many chinks in the armor, speed wise – at some tracks, to really truly contend. I knew the short tracks they were going to have issues, but I feel like they have gotten better on all of those, so they are going to be a viable contender.”
With how the Toyota’s ran in Phoenix earlier this year, does it feel like it is a make-or-break season?
“It could be. Next year might be another good opportunity. I don’t know, but certainly, I’ve gone to Phoenix, and I will never forget when Coy (Gibbs) told my mom flying to Phoenix that we have no chance, so don’t get your hopes up (laughter). We were in the final four, but our short track stuff was just not good and it suited Hendrick guys that year, and we just didn’t have the speed to contend, but this year there is certainly no excuses. C. Bell (Christopher Bell) was definitely the fastest car in the Spring there. We qualified on the pole and contended. I just hope to have the opportunity and see where I stack up.”
Are you interested in trying to get Pato O’Ward in for Mexico?
“Yeah, I saw his interest in that. A talent like him (Pato O’Ward) would be fantastic and with him raising his hand and wanting to participate, logistically you hope it could be possible.”